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FROM MN GOP LEADERSHIP E-MAIL: “…THE DFL DID NOT HOLD A TRUE CAUCUS”
By Michael B. Brodkorb | February 8, 2008
"Please keep two important points in mind to maintain perspective. First, the party holding the White House has had lower caucus/primary turnout in 9 of the last 10 presidential years; the exception was 1980 for the Carter/Kennedy primary battle. Despite having higher Democrat turnout during the nomination process, Republicans went on to win the White House in 1972, 1980, 1984, 1988, 2004, and soon to be 2008. Caucus or primary turnout is historically not an accurate indicator of who will win in November.
Second, the DFL did not hold a true caucus. The DFL chair has spent the last two weeks on radio and TV with me telling DFLers that they could simply sign in, cast their ballot for president, and leave all in one minute if they wished at anytime between 6:30 and 8:00 PM. Reports are that hordes of DFLers did just that: vote and leave. At my own caucus over 90% of the attendees were new from the 2006 caucus. I was anxious to see how many people would bolt for the door once they had voted. I was thrilled that not one of the forty-six people in my caucus left after voting. Our participation represents people who actually caucused and want to be more intimately involved; the DFL conducted a quasi-primary under the broad umbrella of the word 'caucus'. Their 'quantity' is no match for our 'quality' of participation." Source: MN GOP leadership e-mail, February 7, 2008
Topics: MN GOP | 58 Comments »
58 Responses to “FROM MN GOP LEADERSHIP E-MAIL: “…THE DFL DID NOT HOLD A TRUE CAUCUS””
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February 8th, 2008 at 9:51 am
ROFLMAO!!!
You guys go for that; it works for you.
Here on terra firma, we look at turnout, donations, etc etc etc….
And across the country, you guys are gettin’ spanked.
February 8th, 2008 at 9:59 am
Nice try to spin, but it completely falls flat.
Democrats turned out in overwhelming numbers, because they are sick of what Bush and company have done to this country. They were so fed up, they waited sometimes hours in lines, put up with significant traffic jams and packed classrooms like sardines to have their voice heard. Contrary to your spin, most did not leave after casting their ballot.
But go on, don’t worry, your the same guys who thought the Iraqis would be throwing flowers at us… we all know how well that proved to be true.
February 8th, 2008 at 10:02 am
Like most everything that comes out of a DFLers mouth, it’s either a lie or a distortion. The only way Demcorats win is when they lie about having conservative intentions.
Ask Tim Walz. That phony socialist prick ran as an independent, somewhat conservative. But he’s materialized as nothing but another nanny-state promoting, ant-business, pro-bureaucracy purse poodle.
February 8th, 2008 at 10:13 am
Say, Chestnut?
Keep sayin’ that; loudly and often! Especially that stuff about Sergeant Major Walz. But, don’t hold back – tell everyone how you really, Really, REALLY feel!!!
It’s people like you that will make a difference in November’s election results!!!
February 8th, 2008 at 10:17 am
At my DFL caucus location over 140 votes were cast for president, yet there were only about 30 people in the room who stayed for the caucus proceedings. Judging by statewide returns, Hennepin and Ramsey County represent only 1/3 of the statewide population, but represented over 57% of the caucus voting. I doubt most of these people stayed for their caucus meetings. Maybe outstate Minnesota was a true caucus, based on lower attendance, but in the metro area, it was a major DFL SNAFU, which made voting difficult if not impossible for thousands of people who wanted to participate. My co-workers, who all wanted to caucus, decided against it when they got caught in traffic jams, or could not find a place to park. Add to this the lines and confusion once you got into the caucus-site and the DFL party should be ashamed of itself.
February 8th, 2008 at 10:23 am
Keep trying Michael. Maybe one day you’ll get one of your stupid accusations to stick.
February 8th, 2008 at 10:23 am
“…it was a major DFL SNAFU, which made voting difficult if not impossible for thousands of people who wanted to participate. My co-workers, who all wanted to caucus, decided against it when they got caught in traffic jams, or could not find a place to park.”
DAMN straight!!! Why, if we had passed that gas user fee, and built more and better roads, and had more and better mass-transit, those folks wouldn’t have been stuck in traffic!!!
Oh, wait – it’s the obstructionist republiCons that don’t want to raise the gas user fee, and don’t want mass transit.
Doncha hate it, when a perfectly good rant turns out so (cheney)in WRONG??!?
February 8th, 2008 at 10:31 am
“Democrats turned out in overwhelming numbers, because they are sick of what Bush and company have done to this country.”
You’re right. Democrats are tired of the Bush’s exemplary stewardship of the economy, the historic unemployment rate the Bush economy has delivered and sustained, his successful war on radical Islam, the huge gains improving the country’s education system, his calls to reform entitlement programs that are killing us…
Yep, those damn, dumb socialist bastards have a lot to be tired of.
February 8th, 2008 at 11:54 am
Are you trying to be Rip Van Winkle Chestnut?
-Bush’s exemplary stewardship of the economy! LOL! How can you keep a straight face?!!?!?
-Successful war on radical Islam! LOL!
Where’s Bin Laden? How’s HAMAS? Have we stopped Iran’s nuke construction?
-Huge gains improving the country’s education system! LOL!
Even Minnesota Republicans want no child left behind abolished. It has been viewed by most as very poorly planned and implemented.
February 8th, 2008 at 12:04 pm
Freedom’s Eagle,
I had a very different experience, we had probably 260 people in my precinct. All of them got to vote and only about 10% left after voting (some of them had small kids, so that makes sense).
We picked delegates to the Senate District convention, which was orderly and then debated resolutions very orderly as well. It was crowded, but most were very pumped up about November.
Could the DFL have done a better job? Sure, but it’s much better to have this problem then nobody showing up. What’s clear is that Democrats are extremly motivated and excited about their choices going into this election, whereas the Republicans are not.
Carey should be very worried that Minnesota may not even be a swing state this cycle.
February 8th, 2008 at 12:04 pm
Easy
The Bush economy: 59+ continuous months of expansion. Low unemployment. Salaries increasing in real dollars. Every measure of the Bush economy has been remarkable.
Successful war on radical Islam: Al-Queda on the run, shrinking in numbers, low on cash. Defeated in Afghanistan. Uprising in Iraq crushed. Palestinians flailing in their own shit. It’s called victory.
Education: For the first time in history, blacks and Hispanics are closing the achievement gap with whites. All students are performing academically. If it’s poorly implemented, then it will be fixed. And preferably, the liberal socialists fucking it up will be thrown out… another provision of No Child Left Behind — failing administrators get tossed.
You you have to blind, ignorant or just plain stupid not to recognize these facts. However, you’ve already admitted being a liberal. Which is the same as blind, ignorant and stupid.
February 8th, 2008 at 12:06 pm
Klondike, when has Minnesota ever been a swing state? It was close to being considered one a few years ago. However, the state is teaming with Marxist socialist retards…. that’s a tough cycle to break.
February 8th, 2008 at 1:14 pm
I was very encouraged by the enthusiasm of the Republicans who attended the caucus I convened, Maple Grove P-21. In 2006, 3 people attended my precinct caucus. This year, 84 people voted in the presidential preference poll in my precinct.
Even more encouraging was the eagerness of these folks to really get involved. Hardly anyone left after we voted for president, and people were running up to me saying things like “I forgot to put my email on the sign-in sheet” or “let me put my cell phone number on the sign-in sheet.” In 10+ years of attending precinct caucuses, I have never experienced this.
February 8th, 2008 at 1:20 pm
Let’s see, those who showed up at a DFL caucus cast votes that were binding on how they wanted Minnesotans to be represented at the national convention. Direct proportional voting.
Those who attended a GOP caucus cast votes that had no significance whatsoever, leaving it to the party hacks to determine how THEY will represent the rest of their GOP schlubs. All the relevance of a beauty contest.
Who held the “true” caucus? Nice try, Mike. Is this the political brilliance that Coleman, Carey and Timmy the Tool pay you for?
February 8th, 2008 at 1:24 pm
Easy to disprove
The Bush Economy
-The first sustained period of economic growth since World War II that fails to offer a prolonged increase in real wages for most workers.
-The median hourly wage for American workers has declined 2 percent since 2003, after factoring in inflation.
-Wages and salaries now make up the lowest share of the nation’s gross domestic product since the government began recording the data in 1947, while corporate profits have climbed to their highest share since the 1960’s. UBS, the investment bank, recently described the current period as “the golden era of profitability.â€
-The buying power of the minimum wage is at a 50-year low
So it’s pretty clear times are good if your a CEO, but for the average Joe the economy is fair at best.
War on radical Islam
-Bin Laden still not captured! The man responsible for the largest terrorist attack in history on the US is still on the loose!
-Al Qaida has stronger ties in Europe and continues to have cells in the US
-Al Qaida continues to commit terrorist attacks around the globe.
-Al Qaida still killing hundreds with suicide bombings in Iraq
Education
“All students performing academically”!!!
-Are you for real? What fucking planet do you live on?
As for test scores, “the independent body that administers the tests urged caution, saying that much of the improvement could have come from reforms put in place before passage of the 2002 No Child Left Behind Act.”
You obviously don’t even listen to your own party members who recently had a press conference urging Minnesota to leave no child left behind because it is a failure. Are they ignorant, blind and stupid?
February 8th, 2008 at 1:46 pm
Setting optimal tax policy requires governing with facts rather than popular mythology, which is why it is important to set the record straight by debunking 10 myths about the Bush tax cuts.
Ten Myths About the Bush Tax Cuts—and the Facts
Myth #1: Tax revenues remain low.
Fact: Tax revenues are above the historical average, even after the tax cuts.
Myth #2: The Bush tax cuts substantially reduced 2006 revenues and expanded the budget deficit.
Fact: Nearly all of the 2006 budget deficit resulted from additional spending above the baseline.
Myth #3: Supply-side economics assumes that all tax cuts immediately pay for themselves.
Fact: It assumes replenishment of some but not necessarily all lost revenues.
Myth #4: Capital gains tax cuts do not pay for themselves.
Fact: Capital gains tax revenues doubled following the 2003 tax cut.
Myth #5: The Bush tax cuts are to blame for the projected long-term budget deficits.
Fact: Projections show that entitlement costs will dwarf the projected large revenue increases.
Myth #6: Raising tax rates is the best way to raise revenue.
Fact: Tax revenues correlate with economic growth, not tax rates.
Myth #7: Reversing the upper-income tax cuts would raise substantial revenues.
Fact: The low-income tax cuts reduced revenues the most.
Myth #8: Tax cuts help the economy by “putting money in people’s pockets.”
Fact: Pro-growth tax cuts support incentives for productive behavior.
Myth #9: The Bush tax cuts have not helped the economy.
Fact: The economy responded strongly to the 2003 tax cuts.
Myth #10: The Bush tax cuts were tilted toward the rich.
Fact: The rich are now shouldering even more of the income tax burden.
The 110th Congress will be serving when the first of 77 million baby boomers receive their first Social Security checks in 2008. The subsequent avalanche of Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid costs for these baby boomers will be the greatest economic challenge of this era.
This should be the budgetary focus of the 110th Congress rather than repealing Bush tax cuts or allowing them to expire. Repealing the tax cuts would not significantly increase revenues. It would, however, decrease investment, reduce work incenÂtives, stifle entrepreneurialism, and reduce ecoÂnomic growth. Lawmakers should remember that America cannot tax itself to prosperity.
February 8th, 2008 at 2:28 pm
what is the point? do you guys use this forum to try to give false hope to yourselves? this post is ridiculous.
I guess whatever gets you through the day though, keep on telling yourselves what you wanna hear.
Good stuff…….
February 8th, 2008 at 2:36 pm
Wow Ian,
You had to dig pretty deep to find any misery. You’re completely full of shit. … particularly because real wages are actually up, beyond inflation… But nice digging. I hope you had fun.
Citing unsubstantiated leftist bullshit doesn’t make for much of an argument. Ask DJZ or Two Putt Tommy.
February 8th, 2008 at 2:46 pm
Yep, Chestnut is correct. The world is safer(Bhutto was just in the wrong place at the wrong time), Al Quieda is almost gone(since we are victorious, can we come home now?), the economy is going along great- just peachy(ignore the fed changes recently), education is dandy (nevermind Bush underfunds HIS OWN NCLB by billions).
Yeah Chesty, everything is swell. Too bad we can’t re-elect Bush. Wait, we have McCain- an older, balder, more war version of Bush.
All will be fine.
February 8th, 2008 at 3:26 pm
The D_L is going to have a hard time holding these people interested for nine more months.
February 8th, 2008 at 3:50 pm
DJZ, you do realize that congress provides funding, not the President don’t you? Maybe Ted Kennedy, who wrote the NCLB legislation could have influenced that better…
Fact is, the economy is over-performing, so are our students, and Al Queda is getting squashed. You’d have to be a Democrat to deny it. But then, Democrats don’t function well with facts or in reality.
February 8th, 2008 at 4:10 pm
The trouble with liberals is not that they are ignorant, but that they know so much that isn’t so.
February 8th, 2008 at 4:21 pm
Say, Bill?
“Facts are stupid things.”
Uncle Ronnie said it; republiCons live it.
February 8th, 2008 at 4:24 pm
It is funny how the left eat their own: Today, Shuster disses Chelsea and is suspended-
disrespecting the MSM’s God, the Clintons, and you risk your job.
A couple of weeks ago another NBC reporter, Erin Burnett, called the President a “monkey†and she suffered little. But remember, there is no bias at NBC. Just ask them….they will tell you the same thing.
February 8th, 2008 at 4:25 pm
ROFLMAO!!!
Only on your world, pal. Here on terra firma, in the reality-based world, things are different than where you live, Planet Denial.
February 8th, 2008 at 4:38 pm
Still selling that Louisville Golf “Smart” persimmon Driver?
February 8th, 2008 at 5:27 pm
If you’re buyin’; sure!
February 8th, 2008 at 5:40 pm
Clintons, like all democrats have no honor.
Hillary’s campaign stiffed a landlord on a week’s worth of rent, and trashed the building to boot.
http://www.seacoastonline.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080208/NEWS/802080448
And some of her supporters who worked in a New Mexico polling place took home several ballot boxes after the election and those ballots still haven’t been counted. Sounds like they just disinfranchised a whole bunch of their own voters. Those ballots shouldn’t ever be counted now because you know that witch’s staff stuffed full of votes for her.
http://haussamen.blogspot.com/2008/02/uncounted-rio-arriba-county-ballots.html
February 8th, 2008 at 6:01 pm
Say, dogbreath?
From your second link:
“I understand there was a big snowstorm up there, and I realize people were up late and might have slept in this morning. It’s possible – perhaps even likely – that there is nothing fishy going on here.”
Do try to keep up, won’t you?
February 8th, 2008 at 8:32 pm
I’d say the DFL held more of a truer caucus than the Meeker County GOP. The Ron Paul Revolution ran rampant in Meeker County and GOP officials simply reported zeros for 29 of 30 precincts in Meeker County. The Litchfield Independent Review posted that Ron Paul won all of Litchfields wards…and the others simply reported zero?
http://buildourparty.blogspot.com/2008/02/democracy-101-meeker-county-republican.html
While the Minnesota GOP wants to reform how we vote, perhaps they should start by properly counting their own!
February 9th, 2008 at 12:11 am
Chestnut, the economy is on its way into a recession and the stock market is free-falling, 300 points down for the DOW the other day.
I find it perfectly acceptable to stop in, cast your vote and leave. This post is horrible and is really a stretch.
And to say the turn out didnt matter much is RIDICULOUS! Former GOP record turnout, 55,000, now its 65,000, congrats. Former DFL record, 75,000, new record, 230,000!!!!!!! Seriously, we are excited as hell, you are not, you are going to lose, badly.
February 9th, 2008 at 1:36 am
Reality doesn’t enter into Chestnut’s world. I swear, he must be a satirist and a damn good one because no one could write that post with a straight face. The Bush economy is a disaster, from turning a 400 billion surplus into a 700 billion deficit, doubling the national debt, wages have decreased, poverty has increased, unemployment has increased and his administration hasn’t created 1/4 of the jobs that were created in the 90’s. Iraq is still a disaster, and Al-Qaeda has increased in strength, along with the Taliban, in Afghanistan. I guess Chestnut would dispute the Directer of National Intelligence who came out with that cheery bit of news, along with improving their ability to recruit new members and position operatives inside the US capable of carrying out attacks within. Hmmm, I guess we should have stayed in Afghanistan and finished the job rather than taking on a third rate dictator and de-stabalizing a region that’s been at odds with each other for a thousand freaking years. Oh, and as far as our students? They’re getting their clock cleaned in science and math by the likes of Finland, China and Hong Kong just to name a few. Of course any information that doesn’t agree with whatever opinion has formed in the rock that currently resides on the top of Chestnut’s shoulders will be dismissed as liberal media blather.
February 9th, 2008 at 8:10 am
TwoPuttTommy is wrong on one count about donations/lack of enthusiasm. The House Republicans outraised the House DFL by a lot in the reports that just got released by the Campaign Finance Board. In fact, the HRCC has more cash on hand than the State DFL party and the State DFL Caucus COMBINED.
While there may be some enthusiasm on the Presidential level for the DFL, there isn’t for the rudderless DFL House Caucus members. When the Clinton machine crushes young/inexperienced Barack, those people will go away, especially the young people.
Freshman Liberal Shelley Madore had about $280 on hand. Yeah, that sounds like people are enthused about her. Goodbye Shelly.
February 9th, 2008 at 8:35 am
Say, ITK?
Remind me what the spending limits are, for a house member?
IOW – your argument is bogus.
February 9th, 2008 at 8:46 am
puddles, even you should be able to understand this (maybe…). The Republicans under Marty have had a very successful year fundraising. The money has been pooring in mostly in small donations of $100 or less by normal everyday people. Why? Becuase the DFL proved in the last session that they exist to do one thing and one thing only – raise taxes! They do not lead, they whine. They do not have an understanding of what the people need or want done in this state as they are to busy attacking and complaining. People want solutions, not bitching. My house representative hasn’t held any type of town meeting since the last election (unless you count DFL fundraising meetings…) and people are starting to notice. It is obvious across the state that the DFL is failing yet again. But you go ahead and keep your head in the clouds (or where ever you have it stuck up today) because the Republicans will be kicking butt this fall!
February 9th, 2008 at 9:50 am
“The Republicans under Marty have had a very successful year fundraising.”
So, they’ve already capped out?
(yawn).
February 9th, 2008 at 11:05 am
Andrew, recession mongering won’t make a recession come true. You dumb bastards have been talking about a recession for 3 years now. I suppose one day you’ll get it right, but the idea that the signals are any stronger now than then is hogwash.
Yes, the Dow dropped 300 points. It’s done that a few times, yet usually finishes off the week with gains. You’re economic analysis drawn from utter ignorance and incompetence. Sure sign you’re a liberal.
What will you say when the Dow gains 300+?
February 9th, 2008 at 11:13 am
Buck: You’re barely worth a response, but what the hell, I’m feeling charitable.
“The Bush economy is a disaster”
Bullshit. It’s one of the strongest economies in history, by every measure.
“from turning a 400 billion surplus into a 700 billion deficit”
The Clinton recession gobbled most of that projected surplus up… oh yeah, and the Clinton enabled terrorist attacks.
It costs some money to re-build the national defense infrastructure that the liberals let deteriorate over 8 years of Clinton Gore.
“wages have decreased,”
No they haven’t… they’ve increased.
“poverty has increased”
No it hasn’t.
“unemployment has increased”
Double no it hasn’t… unemployment, at it’s current high of 5 percent is historically low… and lower than at most points of the Clinton administration.
“and his administration hasn’t created 1/4 of the jobs that were created in the 90’s.”
Those jobs weren’t created either, as the evaporated with the tech bubble. The jobs this economy has created are real jobs, not phantom ones.
“Iraq is still a disaster,”
No it’s not.
“and Al-Qaeda has increased in strength,”
No it hasn’t…. You’ve swallowed this anti-American liberal bullshit so long you don’t have the judgment to know fact from fiction.
On education, American students, thanks to NCLB, have marked the first improvements in scores in 30 years.
Sure, there’s a long way to go… and perhaps when we start demanding the education establishment to teach our kids the essentials, and root out the feel good happy bullshit, even more progress will be gained…
In the meantime, the bi-Partisan NCLB act, driven by President Bush’s policy has been an enormous success.
Goddam man, get a clue, buck. You dumb sonofabitch.
February 9th, 2008 at 11:34 am
“The Bush economy is a disasterâ€
Bullshit. It’s one of the strongest economies in history, by every measure.
Such detail and linked research here it’s hard to refute, except, I’m got this tool on my computer called Google, and when I search out Bush economy performance, I get the following:
http://www.epi.org/content.cfm/webfeatures_snapshots_20051026
Yeah,, um,, not so good, but maybe it get’s better:
http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/01/28/why-doesnt-bush-get-economic-credit/
Nope, not yet:
http://www.motherjones.com/mojoblog/archives/2008/01/7010_bushs_economic.html
Okay, never mind. The criminal Bush’s economy has been underperforming his entire term. Case closed.
“wages have decreased,â€
No they haven’t… they’ve increased.
Again, such research and analysis is so completely impressive I tremble at the task ahead of me. But I press on because I’m a member of the reality based community.
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines06/0228-06.htm
Oops,, that just doesn’t look good. I’m beginning to see a trend.
THE MIDDLE CLASS. Census data on income in 2006 (the latest available) shows that real median family income for working-age households fell $1,336, or 2.4 percent, from 2001, when that income level was $56,062. \
That’s from http://blogs.uwnews.org/politics/default,month,2008-02.aspx
I’ll quit here but I could continue. Chestnut, just because you have a keyboard, doesn’t necessarily mean you should use it.
February 9th, 2008 at 11:40 am
Richard, right around halloween, there was a poll done, on how many folk believed in UFO’s.
And it wasn’t that many.
But, there also was a poll done, on Bush The Lesser’s performance as Prez.
Ya know what? More folk believed in UFO’s, than believed Bush The Lesser was doin’ a good job.
Keep that in mind, when dealin’ with “All Michael’s Children”:
These extremist wingnuts are whackier than a Roswell and/or Area 51 convention…..
February 9th, 2008 at 2:08 pm
The Democrats did not hold a true caucus?? Could have fooled me!! I was Caucus Secretary for ours.
Or is it that the MNGOP numbers, more than in any given year, was still outnumbered 3 to 1 in the state!!
The lines may have been long, quadruple the number of people overall at some sites, yet were taken care of and voted.
February 9th, 2008 at 5:48 pm
“reduce work incentive”…ya suck up Neocons still buying that line? The repub CEO’s are licking their chops while they stick it to us and take more for themselves–Yeah, that’s an America to be proud of–Republicans owe America a huge apology…
February 9th, 2008 at 6:39 pm
Hey Richard,
Mother Jones, Paul Krugman, Common Dreams… ROTFL! The only other left wing kook fringe web site that you’ve left out is the (Communist) Nation.
I trust your sources on the economy as much as I trust Al Capone’s accountant.
February 10th, 2008 at 8:13 am
THE MIDDLE CLASS. Census data on income in 2006 (the latest available) shows that real median family income for working-age households fell $1,336, or 2.4 percent, from 2001, when that income level was $56,062.
Census data=damned communists
Chris=moron
Mother Jones is one of my favorites. Impeccable journalism and strict adherance to the facts. Get your mom to get you a subscription Chris. You might learn a thing or two. Look into the history of Mother Jones herself.
February 10th, 2008 at 9:20 am
Richard, I guess mother jones didn’t bother telling you were the middle class ‘fell’ to. The lower numbers in the middle class don’t represent people dropping down to the lower income levels, they moved UP into the Upper income levels.
February 10th, 2008 at 9:20 am
By the way Richard, define middle class for us ok.
February 10th, 2008 at 9:59 am
Kennedy-Johnson — 5.2%
Clinton — 3.6%
Reagan — 3.4%
Carter — 3.4%
Nixon-Ford — 2.7%
Bush II — 2.6%
Bush I — 1.9%
This is the information from Mother Jones. It is the percentage rate of growth in each administrations term. Bush II did slightly better then Pappy Bush. Alas he’s still sucking hind tit compared to all other administrations, including Carter’s. Honeydog, this is what is known as a fact. This is from Websters:
fact /fækt/ Pronunciation Key – Show Spelled Pronunciation[fakt] Pronunciation Key – Show IPA Pronunciation
–noun 1. something that actually exists; reality; truth: Your fears have no basis in fact.
2. something known to exist or to have happened: Space travel is now a fact.
3. a truth known by actual experience or observation; something known to be true: Scientists gather facts about plant growth.
4. something said to be true or supposed to have happened: The facts given by the witness are highly questionable.
5. Law. Often, facts. an actual or alleged event or circumstance, as distinguished from its legal effect or consequence. Compare question of fact, question of law.
—Idioms6. after the fact, Law. after the commission of a crime: an accessory after the fact.
7. before the fact, Law. prior to the commission of a crime: an accessory before the fact.
8. in fact, actually; really; indeed: In fact, it was a wonder that anyone survived.
——————————————————————————–
[Origin: 1530–40;
February 10th, 2008 at 10:06 am
I know it’s troublesome and upsetting but Kleenex makes plenty of tissues for your precious tears. The economy is in dire straits and that fact can be laid directly on the doorsteps of the Reagan/Bush/Bush economic foolishness. Reaganism is finally and thankfully dead and as a nation now, we can finally get back to real solutions for our problems. No more Laffer curve idiocy. No more trickle down myths. No more supply side fraud. Real economics. To that, you will see dramatic and deep cuts in the defense industry sector. This nation spends more on defense then every other nation on the planet combined and it’s beggering us. We need to invest in green technologies to power our grid and our cars. In other words, we need to get back to what this nation has always done better then any other nation on the planet has done, invent and innovate. When that happens, you’ll see a rennaissance in the world.
February 10th, 2008 at 6:37 pm
Richard;
It’s not nice to bring facts in to wingnutville, they can’t handle the truth
February 10th, 2008 at 6:45 pm
Richard, that’s fucking priceless that you’d cite a bunch of left-wing lunatic sites, and call them facts… Good gravy. What, is your garbage disposal broken?
By the way, how many Democrat enabled terrorist attacks, and Democrat driven recessions did those presidents need to overcome? … oh… that’s right, Only Bush II had to deal with that.
February 10th, 2008 at 7:22 pm
EPI was founded by a group of economic policy experts that includes Jeff Faux, EPI’s first president; economist Barry Bluestone of Northeastern University; Robert Kuttner, columnist for Business Week and Newsweek and editor of The American Prospect; Ray Marshall, former U.S. Secretary of Labor and professor at the LBJ School of Public Affairs, University of Texas-Austin; Robert Reich, former U.S. secretary of labor and professor at Brandeis University; and economist Lester Thurow of the MIT Sloan School of Management.
HeeHaw, them’s a bunch of God Damn communists if I ever seen some. Chester, blaming the messenger is never a good idea. Get over it, Reaganism is dead and the country will prosper for it’s demise.
February 10th, 2008 at 7:40 pm
EPI is a liberal “progressive” (read: socialist) group… nothing more.
February 10th, 2008 at 7:44 pm
… p.s. this country prospered through the 80s and 90s because of Reaganism… what the hell planet are you on?
… oh… never mind… you’re from the school of though that “government creates jobs…”
Shit, show me a country where socialism and liberalism has worked… sorry… been successful… sorry… trying to find another word, because “work” and “successful” are words liberals don’t like.
February 10th, 2008 at 8:40 pm
Chestnut;
Was Bush a cheerleader at the school of thought that “government creates jobs”?
His administration created more government jobs and jobs that were created because of increased government deficit spending then all the rest.
Grover’s bath tub thing didn’t work so well, now did it.
February 11th, 2008 at 6:45 am
HCDFL: The answer is “no.” Not sure why you even asked the question. The rest of your statement illustrates your ignorance.
February 11th, 2008 at 8:04 am
Boy Blunder was a cheerleader at Andover Prep School, not Harvard.
At Harvard, Boy Blunder was Boy Drunker.
Isn’t it amazing what someone born with a silver coke-spoon up their nose, can get away with, with the “right” family connections?
February 11th, 2008 at 8:34 am
” p.s. this country prospered through the 80s and 90s because of Reaganism… what the hell planet are you on?”
Earth. You, of course, are on Planet Denial.
Here on earth, in the “reality-based community”, Reagan is reecognized by increasing the size of government; running up massive federal deficits; signer of three tax hikes; cutting and running from Lebanon; etc etc etc.
“… you’re from the school of though that “government creates jobs…—
Apparently, so was Reagan, and so is Bush The Lesser.
February 11th, 2008 at 5:16 pm
Well, I see Richard didn’t even attempt to answer the question I asked. LOL, I wonder why? My guess is, because he’s make himself look like a fool because the facts aren’t on his side.