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MN GOP PRESS RELEASE: “REPRESENTATIVES DEAN & GAROFALO DECRY FRANKEN ATTACKS ON CATHOLICISM”
By Michael B. Brodkorb | July 31, 2008
I attended this press event. Representative Garofalo and Dean both had trouble repeating some of the statements Al Franken and his contributors like Bill Maher have made about the Catholic church. The material in this press release below from the MN GOP is very disturbing. I’ll have more pictures and comments later today on Minnesota Democrats Exposed.
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St. Paul- Representatives Matt Dean and Pat Garofalo today called on DFL endorsed U.S. Senate Candidate Al Franken to apologize for years of mean-spirited attacks on the religious beliefs of Catholics.
A first step as a part of his apology would be to return political contributions he has received from Catholic hater Bill Maher. Maher has attacked the Pope as a leader of a church of pedophiles and accused him of being a Nazi.
Representatives Dean and Garofalo said that Franken’s history of bigoted attacks against the Catholic Church, the Pope and the church’s teachings will make it impossible for Catholics to consider him a legitimate candidate for the United States Senate.
“Al Franken has made millions of dollars attacking and mocking the religious beliefs of millions of Americans for laughs, especially Catholics,†said Rep. Pat Garofalo. “However, by joking about a gift store that sells small pieces of the skeleton of Jesus Christ and mocking the Catholic faith by imitating priests as pedophiles receiving communion or dogs taking part in confession, Franken has violated the bounds of decency and religious tolerance. It is not satire. It is not humor. It is religious bigotry.
On his radio show, Al Franken has called the Church idiotic because of its concerns about protecting the sanctity of life in the debate over research with human embryos. There is not an element of the Catholic Church that Franken hasn’t been unwilling to treat with scorn, derision and intolerance.â€
By taking donations from Bill Maher it appears to Catholics that Franken is adding Maher’s hateful beliefs to his already bigoted views against Catholics. For example, in April of this year, Maher ridiculed the Catholic Church and the Pope when he said:
“If you have a few hundred followers, and you let some of them molest children, they call you a cult leader. If you have a billion, they call you Pope.â€Â In addition, Maher called the Catholic Church the “Bear Stearns of organized pedophilia.â€
Maher’s comments, like Franken’s, represent a pattern of attacks on the Catholic Church that Reps. Dean and Garofalo say cannot go unanswered.
“Al Franken wants to represent Minnesota in the United States Senate, yet he accepts donations from a man who equates the Catholic Church with being filled with child molesters, and that the Pope is the leader of a church of pedophiles. It is beyond my comprehension that a man who shows such an easy display of Catholic bigotry thinks he should be elected to serve a state in which 25% of the population is Catholic,†said Representative Matt Dean.
Franken & Bill Maher:
Franken Has Received $2,000 In Contributions From Bill Maher. (Open Secrets Website, www.opensecrets.org, Accessed June 30, 2008)
Maher Flashback: Pope Benedict XVI “Used To Be A Naziâ€; Catholics A “Child-Abusing Religious Cult.â€
“Making reference first to the arrest of polygamists suspected of having sex with children in Texas, Maher said that ‘whenever a cult leader sets himself up as God’s infallible wingman here on Earth, lock away the kids. Which is why I’d like to tip off law enforcement to an even larger child-abusing religious cult. Its leader also has a compound, and this guy not only operates outside the bounds of the law, but he used to be a Nazi and he wears funny hats. That’s right, the pope is coming to America this week, and ladies: he’s single.â€â€ (Jay Ambrose, “Maher, Pope Benedict XVI And The Sex Scandal,†Ventura County Star, April 21, 2008)
“’Now, I know what you’re thinking,’ the comedian said. ‘â€Bill, you can’t be saying the Catholic Church is no better than this creepy Texas cult. For one thing, altar boys can’t even get pregnant.†But really, what tripped up the little cult on the prairie was that they only abused hundreds of kids, not thousands all over the world. Cults get raided; religions get parades. If you have a few hundred followers, and you let some of them molest children, they call you a cult leader. If you have a billion, they call you pope.’†(Jay Ambrose, “Maher, Pope Benedict XVI And The Sex Scandal,†Ventura County Star, April 21, 2008)
“Talk show host Bill Maher last week accused Pope Benedict XVI of being a ‘Nazi’ in his youth and heading up a ‘child-abusing religious cult’ – or more precisely, ‘the Bear Stearns of organized pedophilia.’†(David Harsanyi, “Oh, Quit Catholic Bashing, Already,†Denver Post, April 18, 2008)
Maher Refused To Apologize “The following week Maher offered ‘a correction, not an apology’ when he said he would never make a ‘pope is a Nazi’ joke again. But he added that it if the pope was the CEO of a chain of nationwide day care centers, and had helped cover up that thousands of his employees had been caught molesting children, he would be in jail.†(Walt Belcher, “Bill Maher Finds Religion,†Tampa Tribune, May 9, 2008)
Franken’s Long History Of Ridicule
Bizarre Franken Satire: In “Why Not Me,†Ex-President Franken Discovers Complete Skeleton Of Jesus Christ; Pieces Of Christ’s Skeleton Sold At Al Franken Presidential Library:
·       “The President made one hundred and forty digs in the deserts of the Holy Land discovering among other artifacts the complete skeleton of Jesus Christ still nailed to the cross.â€Â  (Al Franken, Why Not Me? 1999, p. 287-288)
·       “You know, if it were up to me, I’d take one of those bones and clone Jesus. I’m kidding of course. Human cloning is a crime and also impossible to do from tissue that is no longer living. Also, speaking from personal experience, I can tell you that any clone of Jesus Christ would have a lot of issues.â€Â  (Al Franken, Why Not Me? 1999, p. 288)
·       “The complete set of video clips of Helicopter Rescue Squad is available in the gift shop along with most of my books and small pieces of Jesus’ skeleton.â€Â (Al Franken, Why Not Me? 1999, p. 289)
God Told Franken To Write Lies And The Lying Liars Who Tell Them. “Actually, God. He asked me to write this book because he was so pissed off at Bush who claimed that he had been chosen by God and God said, actually, he hadn’t. It was chosen by Clarence Thomas.â€Â (Transcript, “CBS Sunday Morning,†CBS, May 9, 2004)
Franken Describes Conversation With God – Where God Uses Repeated Profanities. “Just to set the mood, Al Franken starts Lies with a few ‘lies’ of his own. ‘God told me to write this book,’ he begins. Those books by Ann Coulter and Bernie Goldberg, author of last year’s surprise bestselling expose of the “liberal media,” Bias: A CBS Insider Exposes How the Media Distort the News, says God, are ‘total bull#@*t.’ He commands Franken to go after the ‘liberal bias myth’ and then get Bush and his corporate buddies who are ‘screwing the environment’ and @#$ ing-off the rest of the world.’ God has a mouth.†(Raymond Schroth, “Liberals Fight Back,†National Catholic Reporter, October 31, 2003)
Franken As God On Claims Made In Books By Ann Coulter And Bernie Goldberg: “Total Bullsh*t.†“‘You know those shitty books by Ann Coulter and Bernie Goldberg?’ ‘The best sellers that claim there is a liberal bias in the media?’ I asked. ‘Total bullsh*t,’ God said.â€Â  (“God Spoke,†2006)
Franken: “I Guess It Was God Who Had His Head Up His A**.†“So I asked God where exactly in the Bible he said that. God told me that the Methodist minister had his head up his a**. It doesn’t say that in the Bible.1 (footnote) 1. As it turned out, the minister was right. A reader sent me the following from 2 Thessalonians 2:10-11: “…and with all the deception of wickedness for those who perish, because they did not receive the love of truth so as to be saved. For this reason God will send upon them a deluding influence so that they will believe what is false…â€Â I guess it was God who had his head up his a**.â€Â (Al Franken, Lies And The Lying Liars Who Tell Them, 2004, p. 363)
Franken Ranks “World Religions In Order Of Quality:†1. Judaism (Reform) 2.Judaism (Conservative) 3. Unitarianism 4. Christianity (Mainstream Protestant) 5. Islam (Muhammed Ali/ Ahmad Rashhad-type) 6. Buddhism, Hinduism, Confucianism, etc. 7. Christianity (Roman Catholic) 8. Judaism (Orthodox) 9. Christianity (Fundamentalist) 10. Islam (Fundamentalist)â€Â (Al Franken, Oh, The Things I Know! p. 50, Plume, paperback edition, 2002)
Franken Described Religion As A “Crutch.†“I don’t care what kind of nonsense you believe, I can tell you that religion will be a crutch which you can lean upon in times of adversity.†(Al Franken, Oh, The Things I Know! p. 47, Plume, paperback edition, 2002)
In Extended Conversation On Stem Cells, Franken Calls Church’s Position On Stem Cell Research “Idiotic.†“Woman: “I have great respect for the Catholic Church so I’m not going into that.†Franken: “Well I do too, … We’re going to leave (alone) the Catholic Church’s idiotic stance on this issue.â€Â (The Al Franken Show, Air America Radio, September 19, 2006)
Franken Jokes About The Assassination Of Foreign Leader And Catholic Holy Communion. “Two attempts at humor were offensive. In his ‘oy, oy show,’ set to Israeli music, a sidekick reads news reports – in this case, the murder of the Russian-backed president of Chechnya. Franken’s role is to pipe up with a lighthearted ‘oy, oy, oy.’ Yep, nothing tickles the ribs like assassination. Franken also imitated a priest giving Communion, saying ‘Body of Christ’ when an imagined pedophile priest was in line but ‘not for you’ when pro-choice politicians came up.†(Michael Goodwin, “Liberal Radio Is Airing Bad Jokes And Worst Taste,†New York Daily News, May 12, 2004)
Franken Jokes About Holy Communion. John Dickerson: “I was raised a Catholic so church for me is, ah, you know, full of all the Catholic rituals and, so…†Franken: “Eating and drinking mainly.†Dickerson: “Mostly, that’s right. Right, right.†Franken: “And the wine, can you have more? Can you have like, the wafers, they’re not just like, you don’t just get the wine right?†Dickerson: “You don’t get, you can’t make a sandwich or anything.†Franken: “Or you can’t have them like chips?†Dickerson: “No, no they don’t go with guacamole. And the same’s true with the wine…†Franken: “Is that a sacrilege? I see Joel shaking your head there.†Joel & Dickerson: “Yeah.†Joel: “Yeah, there’s some rules about this.†Franken: “Oh really?†Joel: “Yeah.†Franken: “Even about the joking of it?†Joel: “We’ll go through this after the show.†Franken: “Is it just, like should I just not run for the Senate now?†Dickerson: “Yeah. Yeah, um…â€Â  Franken: “I don’t know. I’m Jewish, I don’t know.†Dickerson: “It’s the body and blood of Christ…â€Â Franken: “Oh, of course.†Dickerson: “…so it’s no small, ah, it’s no small thing and its’ that sacrifice which is the center of , of… Franken: “Yes, yes that I know.â€Â Dickerson: “…the belief, so, ah, people get very touchy…†Franken: “And rightly so.†Dickerson: “…and even us Catholics do.†Franken: “Rightly so. Sorry everybody. I apologize (laughing). I really do. That was…I, I, I (mumbling).â€Â  (The Al Franken Show, Air America, July 13, 2006, 56:58-58:16)
NBC Refused To Air Franken Penned Skit About Dogs Confessing To Priest. “All season long, [Saturday Night Live creator Lorne] Michaels tried to get a sketch called ‘Dog Confessional’ approved. Written by Al Franken, it depicted a series of dogs, played by cast members, confessing to a priest. [NBC censor Richard] Gitter says it would have offended Catholics.â€Â (Tom Shales, “’SNL’ and the Censors; NBC Holds the Line Against Controversy,†The Washington Post, October 7, 1987)
Franken: “Isn’t Cardinal O’Connor An A**hole?â€Â “Thus, when I emceed fund-raisers for Mark Green’s ’86 Senate race, I’d open with: ‘I’ve been asked by the Green campaign to announce that the views I express tonight are mine and not necessarily those of the Green campaign. Okay, now that that’s out of the way… isn’t Cardinal O’Connor an a**hole?’â€Â (Al Franken, Rush Limbaugh Is A Big Fat Idiot, 1996, p. 78)
Franken Jokes about Jesus Lusting Over Mary Magdalene In Imagined SNL Monologue. “I tell you one thing, if Mary Magdalene looked like Barbary Hershey, I might have thought twice about this celibacy thing. I mean, the real Mary Magdalene was about four foot two, 135 pounds. And with bad teeth yet. “ (Al Franken, “ Saturday Night Live Monologue†Harper’s Magazine, April 1989
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82 Responses to “MN GOP PRESS RELEASE: “REPRESENTATIVES DEAN & GAROFALO DECRY FRANKEN ATTACKS ON CATHOLICISM””
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July 31st, 2008 at 2:53 PM
Jeff: Your comment didn’t have anything to do with the subject of this post. Please limit your comments to specifics of the post, or at least rework your comment by also including comments about the post.
July 31st, 2008 at 2:56 PM
Wow. This is stupid.
July 31st, 2008 at 2:58 PM
“Family values” candidates Erik Paulen and Michele Bachmann, take money from a PAC that raised money at a strip club in Las Vegas. Erik P. collected 5,000 dollars from this Pac (Pete Sessions’ PetePac). The Republican Party has some nerve to attack Al Franken for being disrespectful to women for some jokes that he was paid to write as an employee, while they are taking tainted money from fishing trips and strip tease acts.Hypocrites!
July 31st, 2008 at 3:24 PM
I don’t think that neither Norman Coleman nor Al Franken knows much about the most RECENT STUDIES about Mary Magdalene.
If one listens to the homilies [sermons] of Father John Corapi, you will find that technically, indirectly/directly it seems that most American Catholics have ex-communicated themselves because of the issues of birth control pills.
[Father Corapi's MAIN ISSUE is NOT birth control pills. It is the LOVE OF GOD FOR HUMANS.]
Father MARTIN LUTHER was a CATHOLIC PRIEST.
It seems to me that the Casserly-Coleman marriage ceremony may have been performed in a CATHOLIC CHURCH.
Selecting who and what is “sovereign” in your life is tricky because the average person is probably not aware of the “TOTALITY OF THE ISSUES OF SOVEREIGNTY.”
What the Coleman Campaign has opened up here, are ISSUES of SOVEREIGNTY.
Norm may take out the trash and put it in the garbage can but, does he have to have the same RELIGIOUS BELIEF SYSTEM(S) that his wife has in order to please her, or in order to make their marriage workable in the longer term.
July 31st, 2008 at 3:30 PM
Anti-Christian bigotry is mainstream thought in the DFL and in the twin cities media. It won’t get covered. This won’t gain any traction.
For that reason, and because Al Franken is a divisive, hate-mongering prick. He’s pretty much the type of candidate Democrats look for.
July 31st, 2008 at 3:37 PM
There are usually Catholic writings that cover situations where Catholics can be covered if they cannot do things in what might be considered the usually Catholic way.
Most Catholics probably don’t know about these ways, and therefore most non-Catholics probably also never heard about these ways.
July 31st, 2008 at 3:38 PM
“Anti-Christian bigotry is mainstream ”
Oh boo hoo, the poor Christians. Always held down.
July 31st, 2008 at 3:44 PM
C’mon Chestnut, Swiftee is a Catholic. Just review all of the “piehole” words, and other words that he has used on MDE.
Clean up your act(s).
Keying in your: the DFL is anti-Christian stuff doesn’t cut it.
July 31st, 2008 at 3:50 PM
Well it’s true the current Pope was a Nazi. He even admited being in the German Army… now he says it was forced and he never fired a shot, but technically he was a Nazi.
As for the Catholic church, the GOP is opening up pandora’s box… although Franken’s jokes may be in poor taste, the Church leadership had a record of protecting the perverts who committed horrible acts of sexual abuse. They also had a history of belittling the victims and in some cases trying to buy them off. This is a very stupid line of attack.
July 31st, 2008 at 3:53 PM
why should anybody be surprised by franken’s degradation of catholics. he has shown his anti-feminism, anti-child, anti-rule of law and now anti-catholic.
give him some more time and he will be anti-minnesotan.
July 31st, 2008 at 3:55 PM
Q. Will Dean, Garofalo, & Coleman discuss these issues in a CATHOLIC CHURCH during a Mass homily?
A. Probably not.
July 31st, 2008 at 4:04 PM
It seems to me that the incidence of child abuse in the Catholic Church is actually lower than in other churches.
What has Norm selected for his sovereignty on issues of Catholicism?
We already know about taking out the garbage/trash.
July 31st, 2008 at 4:07 PM
Thanks for proving my point, PD.
July 31st, 2008 at 4:14 PM
Magee- Does that mean that anyone who was drafted during the Johnson administration is a Democrat? Or during the Nixon administration is a Republican? Technically, I mean. Or at least that they WERE a member of that party while serving? Does service in the armed forces equal membership of the party in power? I’m pretty sure when I joined that wasn’t part of my oath.
July 31st, 2008 at 4:16 PM
You might have a point there El P when you say “the incidence of child abuse in the Catholic Church is actually lower than in other churches.”
Muslims, for example, pack explosives to their children and send them to the market.
July 31st, 2008 at 4:18 PM
Oh boo hoo, the poor Christians. Always held down.
OK PD you just proved what a scum bag you really are.
I was raised Catholic but my mothers side of the family was Jewish so I have an interest on many sides of this. PD do you hate catholic’s?
I have long known that the DFL and Hollywood hates Catholic’s and the Hate mongering towards Catholic’s from Franken over the years is well documented. Good luck in November because this will get legs.
July 31st, 2008 at 4:27 PM
Liberal can’t stand religion because it means that there are consequences for their actions.
Thats why they attack it.
But they are cowards about it. They will only attack Christianity.
They won’t attack Jews for fear they will be called anti-Semitic.
And they won’t attack Islam for fear of being killed.
July 31st, 2008 at 4:28 PM
“OK PD you just proved what a scum bag you really are.
I was raised Catholic but my mothers side of the family was Jewish so I have an interest on many sides of this. PD do you hate catholic’s?”
Why am I scum and/or why must I hate Catholics to say that Christians aren’t exactly subject to mass discrimination? I mean come on, Christians aren’t exactly blacks, or even subject to the same level of discrimination as other religious faiths, case in point, jews or Muslims.
July 31st, 2008 at 4:30 PM
“Liberal can’t stand religion because it means that there are consequences for their actions.”
This is dumb.
If there is a resentment towards religion it is because religion has traditionally been a significant catalyst for war and intolerance.
July 31st, 2008 at 4:50 PM
PlymouthDem
You don’t know history very well.
Catholics have been persecuted for centuries and if a republican said what you said about African Americans or a Muslim you would go ape shit you double standard prick
July 31st, 2008 at 4:52 PM
Michael doesn’t think my last comment was relevant. I may have to start taking screenshots.
The GOP asks Franken to “return political contributions he has received from Catholic hater Bill Maher.” Yet at the same time, they ignore GOP Congressional candidate Erik Paulsen’s connections to the Missouri Synod, which believes the Pope is the antichrist (link to official synod homepage).
Seems pretty hypocritical to me. Shouldn’t Paulsen have to disavow his Catholic-hating congregation? How can we hold one candidate’s associates up to the light, while ignoring another’s beliefs?
July 31st, 2008 at 4:57 PM
“Catholics have been persecuted for centuries”
What, the first century?
You can’t possibly argue that Catholics in this country have suffered significant persecution for being Catholic (as compared, to say, Irish). And, any Catholic persecution surely does not equate to the persecution suffered by racial groups such as blacks, or religious groups such as jews or muslims.
July 31st, 2008 at 4:57 PM
“This is dumb”
Good one PD, think of that all by yourself?
July 31st, 2008 at 4:59 PM
The Pope wasn’t a Nazi, he was a member of the Hitler youth, big difference. This Pope and the Pope before him, went to great lengths to reach out to the Jewish community and try to reconcile Pope Pius the XII blank check he gave Hitler during WWII.
I am in no way defending Catholicism or any sect of Christianity, their past offenses are long, horrible, and unforgivable. But at the same time the truth is the truth, and Ratzinger/Benedict was in fact not a Nazi.
July 31st, 2008 at 5:19 PM
These are questions/issues of “sovereignty”?
What kind of birth control did/do the Coleman’s use?
Are THEY practicing Catholics?
Is Laurie a practicing CATHOLIC?
Are THEY TYPICAL AMERICAN practicing CATHOLICS?
Is Norm a practicing CATHOLIC?
When they married, how far, how much, and what exactly, did the SOVEREIGNTY OF THE CATHOLIC CHURCH exert influence over their lives?
July 31st, 2008 at 5:26 PM
George & Laura Bush were dwarfed on the World Stage with it came to attending services at the Vatican for Pope John Paul II.
I was in Mexico City, and walked into the very large church on the main plaza.
It was very crowded. I hadn’t heard that Pope John Paul I had died until I was actually in the very large Church (Guadalupe).
July 31st, 2008 at 6:32 PM
PD- You think one of the reasons that the Irish were discriminated against might have been that they were overwhelming Catholic? I think you need to study up on the history of the Klan a bit. Catholics were quite high on their hate list too. I also doubt if you can find cases of outright discrimination against Muslims in the US that in any way compare with that which was practiced against Catholics in the past. Even today, the Catholic Church is far more often publicly ridiculed and maligned in popular culture than Islam is. Of course, it doesn’t take a lot of courage or original thought to make fun of the Pope. After all, no one is going to cut your head off for that.
July 31st, 2008 at 7:22 PM
El presidente and a few others on this sight are ignorant about Catholics and the Catholic church.Educate yourselves before discussing Father Corpi, John Paul II, Benedict or Mary Magdalene,or why Martin Luther left the church.Al Franken and his ilk are persecuting present day Catholics with their disrespect and ignorance.George Bush won the Catholic vote and the likes of Al and Obama will not.
July 31st, 2008 at 7:29 PM
“If there is a resentment towards religion it is because religion has traditionally been a significant catalyst for war and intolerance.”
Tell that to the tens of millions killed at the hands of secular communists.
July 31st, 2008 at 7:31 PM
PD says: “You can’t possibly argue that Catholics in this country have suffered significant persecution for being Catholic (as compared, to say, Irish).”
And apparently is ignorant of the fact that the Irish were persecuted BECAUSE they were Catholic.
July 31st, 2008 at 8:11 PM
“Tell that to the tens of millions killed at the hands of secular communists.”
Saying others did it too is not a defense to my original statement.
July 31st, 2008 at 8:21 PM
As I’ve said before- the Catholic Church is fair game for the for the loony left. You can attack our religion and nobody cares.
Franken, Maher- half you hateful people posting calling the Pope a Nazi…I’m fed up.
“The Pope and Witch” play at the U last year – can you IMAGINE a play denegrating the Prophet Mohammed…then the Professor at U of M Morris who says people should go into Chatholic Churches- go up for communion and then desecreate the hosts– SICK!! If some tax-paid jerk told students to go into Mosques and take a page out of the Koran and rip it up- you’d NEVER hear the end of it out of the Strib– has any mainstream media source in the Twin Cities reported on that Story? Nope- because we’re Catholic our religion is fair game for hate-filled liberals.
You want to talk Hypocrites huh?
July 31st, 2008 at 8:27 PM
So how do the Catholic Church and Reps. Dean and Garofalo feel about strippers anyway?
July 31st, 2008 at 8:30 PM
Oh- and the 1st century is the last time Catholics were persecuted? Hundreds of Catholic priests were killed during the Holocaust.
Where the heck do you people go to school- Seriously?
July 31st, 2008 at 8:36 PM
“Hundreds of Catholic priests were killed during the Holocaust.”
That’s your defense to the statement that catholics don’t have it nearly as bad (or anywhere near), oh, say JEWS?
It’s ridiculous for people to claim that Catholics are held down by discrimination in this country.
July 31st, 2008 at 9:00 PM
“Saying others did it too is not a defense to my original statement.”
If you can’t keep up with the conversation, then go eat your milk and cookies and go to bed.
Your stupid remark was that Catholicism and religion is the cause of war. So, in reality, pointing to the wanton slaughter of innocents by atheistic tyrants IS a good counter that something other than religion causes war.
July 31st, 2008 at 9:02 PM
“It’s ridiculous for people to claim that Catholics are held down by discrimination in this country.”
It’s ignorant as heck for you to claim that Catholics aren’t discriminated against.
July 31st, 2008 at 9:13 PM
“Your stupid remark was that Catholicism and religion is the cause of war. So, in reality, pointing to the wanton slaughter of innocents by atheistic tyrants IS a good counter that something other than religion causes war.”
I said religion is a significant catalyst for war and intolerance. That doesn’t mean that oil might not also be a catalyst for war. It doesn’t disprove my statement by saying something else causes war.
Let’s teach you some basic logic:
A -> B
and
C -> B
That doesn’t mean
A !-> B.
July 31st, 2008 at 9:21 PM
Shozzy,
well for one we didn’t go to Catholic schools, where they put more emphasis on the few Catholics priests(relative to say Jews, Homosexuals, Roma, disabled, genetically flawed,etc.) that were killed during the Holocaust. Catholics and Catholic priests for that matter were not killed because of their being Catholics but because of their being genetically un-pure ie. the Poles. There were in fact many Nazi elites who were baptized as Catholic, if not practicing at the time.
Chestnut,
You can not sit here and try to say that secularism created more death and/or war compared to that of religion, be it Christian, Muslim, Jew, or whoever else. Religion has been the root of most war throughout the centuries. I know it may not fit into your Jesus loving Republican party, but try, for once, to take off the blinders and take a strong whiff of reality my friend.
July 31st, 2008 at 9:24 PM
That’s right, PD… lots of things cause tension and war. Religion is no greater or less than any of the others.
Thanks for proving my point that your comment was stupid.
July 31st, 2008 at 9:26 PM
Yoni,
I never said that. I said it’s stupid to put war at the feet of religious belief. It is no greater or lesser a cause of war and death than any other cause — territory, resource control, greed, etc.
I will tell you that secularists have killed millions more than religious conflicts in the last 500 years, however.
July 31st, 2008 at 9:29 PM
The bottom line is this: Christianity has become the only thing that it is acceptable to discriminate against and to be bigoted toward.
I made the original comment that pointing out Franken’s anti-Christian bigotry will fail to gain much traction because anti-Christian bigotry is mainstream, particularly among liberals.
I stand by that assertion.
July 31st, 2008 at 9:32 PM
“It’s ignorant as heck for you to claim that Catholics aren’t discriminated against.”
Are you capable of reading?
When did I say they experience NO persecution? Hell, people who read TMZ are persecuted. But, boo hoo Catholics because the amount of persecution they’ve suffered in this country (or suffer now) is nothing compared to what other groups suffer.
“Thanks for proving my point that your comment was stupid.”
Again, how does my statement disprove my argument that religion is a significant catalyst to war and intolerance?
July 31st, 2008 at 9:41 PM
“But, boo hoo Catholics because the amount of persecution they’ve suffered in this country (or suffer now) is nothing compared to what other groups suffer.”
So are you saying Catholics haven’t suffered enough for you to defend them?
July 31st, 2008 at 10:01 PM
“So are you saying Catholics haven’t suffered enough for you to defend them?”
Umm… yes?
No one on this website has articulated what discrimination catholics face beyond people pointing out that you had a bit of a pedophile problem (which you did) and that your pope was involved with the Nazis (which, he was). This isn’t exactly Catholics being denied jobs, being profiled, or denied anything like other groups do. Catholics also aren’t exactly a disenfranchised group either.
At what point did you people, the same ones that complain about the over politically correct society, suddenly so offended by people saying statements that might be offensive to your faith? What, does that argument only work when those statements are made about other groups? Are we only too politically correct when the statements are made about jews, muslims, or blacks?
July 31st, 2008 at 10:05 PM
Let the record show that PlymouthDem is comfortable with bigotry.
July 31st, 2008 at 10:09 PM
[...] and Pat Garofalo today called on DFL endorsed U.S. Senate Candidate Al Franken to apologize for yhttp://www.minnesotademocratsexposed.com/2008/07/31/mn-gop-press-release-representatives-dean-garofa…7:15am — Cult Leader’s Attorney Wants Indictment Tossed Albuquerque JournalRaton lawyer says Wayne [...]
July 31st, 2008 at 10:10 PM
“Let the record show that PlymouthDem is comfortable with bigotry.”
If by bigotry you mean acts that NO ONE can articulate, than, yes.
You people are remarkable. You jump up and down when people complaint, for example, when they are forced to celebrate Christmas when it has nothing to do with their faith and yet if someone points out that you have an issue with priests in your religion you equate it to the holocaust.
July 31st, 2008 at 10:16 PM
Who has ever, ever been forced to celebrate Christmas?
Quite possibly the most ridiculous remark you’ve ever made PD… and that’s quite an accomplishment.
July 31st, 2008 at 10:16 PM
Still, the fact remains, you’re comfortable with bigotry. You said it yourself.
July 31st, 2008 at 10:22 PM
“Let the record show that PlymouthDem is comfortable with bigotry.”
You got me, I’m not against people pointing out that Catholic priests sexually abused children, when in fact they did.
July 31st, 2008 at 10:27 PM
It’s o.k., PD. Your comfort with bigotry is what makes you such a good Democrat. You see, Democrats are fine with any persecution of any group of people that they can’t consider their political dependents.
To be sure, Hype said: “So are you saying Catholics haven’t suffered enough for you to defend them?”
PD said: “Umm… yes?”
You’re comfortable with bigotry.
July 31st, 2008 at 10:32 PM
which I followed up with… “no one on this website has articulated what discrimination catholics face.”
I’m not against non-existent bigotry.
July 31st, 2008 at 10:34 PM
“It’s o.k., PD. Your comfort with bigotry is what makes you such a good Democrat.”
And again, you’ve yet to argue with the fact that republicans are against political correctness … unless it’s designed to protect catholics.
August 1st, 2008 at 12:07 AM
Catholics can make the claim they were persecuted last century, but today they are a powerful force in America.
The Catholic church establishment uses the church to punish those who oppose their views on abortion, stem cell research, homosexuality and other issues.
What you also ignore is that your average Catholic probably makes more jokes about their religion then anybody else does and unlike these GOP prudes most have a sense of humor.
What the GOP talking heads also forget is the fact that even though Minnesota has a very small Jewish population the last 3 Senators to hold this seat have been Jewish. So trying to divide and conquer via religion isn’t going to win you any brownie points (ie votes). People want someone who can do the job and that obviously isn’t Norman, who has to flip a coin everyday to determine his position on any issue.
August 1st, 2008 at 8:02 AM
HUGO
Catholics can make the claim they were persecuted last century, but today they are a powerful force in America.
Catholics have been persecuted for thousands of years. And still are persecuted. http://www.ourcatholicfaith.org/churchhistory.html
The Catholic Church establishment uses the church to punish those who oppose their views on abortion, stem cell research, homosexuality and other issues.
What an ignorant statement. Who do they punish? They stand for what they believe in. Islamic believe they should exterminate the infidels?
Yes the last three have been of the Jewish faith but there faith has never come in to Question!! And every Catholic I know doesn’t have a problem with them. What we (I) have a problem with is Franken’s long history of bigotry towards Catholics. He can’t run from his past and people from every domination should stand agents Franken and his racist views. If any of you defends his views you are condoning his racism.
August 1st, 2008 at 8:31 AM
I don’t get how any of this is taken as a joke.
STATEMENT: Franken said the Pope was a Nazi.
FACT: The Pope was a member of the Hitler Youth.
STATEMENT: The church protects pedophiles.
FACT: The church protects pedophiles.
STATEMENT: Disrespecting the Pope is wrong.
FACT: Eric Paulsen’s church believes the Pope is the Antichrist, yet he gets a free pass.
STATEMENT: Bill Maher said…
FACT: If republicans want to start disqualifying donors for their past statements/actions, I’m sure the DFL would be fine with the net results.
August 1st, 2008 at 8:39 AM
Keep defending him Leroy and you will be rewarded with 72 virgins
August 1st, 2008 at 8:55 AM
“If any of you defends his views you are condoning his racism.”
At what point did Catholics become a race?
August 1st, 2008 at 9:20 AM
WOW PD you will stop at nothing to defend how wrong you are on the issue. Being catholic is a race just like the Palliations and the Jews. Try telling the Irish the there faith is not part of a race. They have been fighting for there race for hundreds of years.
PD you an ass clown who constantly throws shit against the wall to see if it sticks and a race bater. Also I am convinced you are a paid to spot off on this site.
August 1st, 2008 at 9:38 AM
Hottip,
So, I’m guessing you put “catholic” when your driver’s license application requests race? A religion is not a race. Jews, catholics, or any religion do not share a single ancestry or genetic distinction. I can, for example, be an irish jew. I could the very next day become an irish protestant. I didn’t miraculously change my race.
August 1st, 2008 at 10:20 AM
It doesn’t surprise me that Franken would create crude “jokes” about Catholics (would these be considered “comedy” or “satire” and would they be categorized as part of the jokes “he is not proud of”?). Honestly, who finds any of his old potty humor or expletive laced bits funny?
Although I strongly disagree with Catholic doctrine and their ugly history of persecuting other Christians they disagreed with (hottip- I suggest you read Foxes Book of Martyrs and The Trail of Blood), I would never dream of insulting or berating any Catholic. Franken could learn a great lesson from me and many other sane intellectuals by offering constructive criticism when you get the chance with the person you disagree with other producing vile jokes that accomplish nothing.
That garbage he produced over his “comedic” career may have appealed to the lowest common denominator over the years, but it is hard to run away from it when you are put under the micro-scope.
I still don’t know how this guy got the endorsement!! It baffles me everyday!! He is going to be poison to the Dems right down the ballot. What were the Dems thinking! Just imagine if the Dems would have endorsed a mildly “centrist” candidate to run against Coleman (a Senator that I am not proud of in the least)instead of this far-left polarizer. They got their work cut out for ‘em!
August 1st, 2008 at 10:55 AM
How is pointing to the disconnect between the pro-life stance and the anti-stem cell research stance comedy?
If every life is sacred, why are cells from aborted fetuses more sacred than the living?
August 1st, 2008 at 11:13 AM
Leroy, what disconnect exists between a pro-life stance and opposition to killing people for medical research?
The positions of the Catholic church on that issue couldn’t be more consistent.
August 1st, 2008 at 11:30 AM
That would be true if the people were being killed for medical research. And I don’t believe anyone ever has advocated that. What the church opposes is using the cells of the dead for research that could help the living.
It seems the republicans have ranked humanity.
1) Living fetuses
2) Dead fetuses
3) Norm Coleman
4) The terminally ill.
Call me silly, but I think people fighting traumatic terminal illnesses should be treated with at least the same amount of respect as an aborted fetus. If the Catholics/Republicans were smart, they would get behind this, so they could say that at least the abortions they oppose were providing some greater good.
August 1st, 2008 at 11:37 AM
Leroy, in embryonic stem cell research, a person is killed. Anyone who advocates embryonic stem cell research advocates killing people for medical research.
Moreover, embryonic stem cell research is risky as hell. It’s delivered no cures, and has little promise of doing so.
The Catholic church whole-heartedly supports adult stem cell research, which has delivered many cures and has much immediate and long-term promise.
August 1st, 2008 at 11:40 AM
Leroy, a nazi named Dr. Megela conducted extensive medical research on jews in the camps that were slated to be exterminated.
All of his findings were tossed for ethical reasons. By your logic, his research is valid because it was conducted on people who were going to be murdered anyway.
That’s a tough ethical stand to take. Nonetheless, that’s the stand the Democrat party seems to have aligned with.
August 1st, 2008 at 11:52 AM
Conversely, if the Democrat party were smart, it would pull its collective head out of its ass and align with forces dedicated to protecting human dignity and the rights of the voiceless.
August 1st, 2008 at 11:53 AM
Chestnut. Much like many of your opinions on here, you are absolutely incorrect on the FACTS upon which you base your opinions.
But as the EFCA debate proved, no amount of showing you the actual facts can sway your beliefs from the bogus facts you have already created, so I won’t even bother spending any more time, as I don’t believe you have any interest in learning about the issues which you so frequently misinterpret.
August 1st, 2008 at 12:23 PM
Leroy,
Then prove me wrong.
In the EFCA debate, I am demonstrably correct. The EFCA DOES eliminate the right to a private ballot. That FACT is indisputable.
In this debate, I also am indisputably correct: The Catholic church’s stance on pro-life is fully consistent with its stance against killing people for medical research.
My FACTS are rock solid. I’m not sure what to say of the so-called “facts” you deploy… but I think they’d be categorized as bullshit opinion.
August 1st, 2008 at 12:26 PM
And let me put a finer point on it for you Leroy: The Catholic church’s pro-life stance is fully congruent with its stance against killing people for medical research or desecrating human remains for the same.
I know that’s hard for you to reconcile, but those is the facts.
August 1st, 2008 at 1:26 PM
I.R
(I suggest you read Foxes Book of Martyrs and The Trail of Blood),I will look for it this weekend.
August 1st, 2008 at 2:02 PM
Chestnut-
The EFCA does NOT remove the secret ballot. And you have never provided any proof other than your own opinion to say otherwise. Repeating yourself, and then quoting your own misstatements does not make a lie true.
And there has never been one iota of debate over killing humans for research. You and I both know that fetuses are the question. And the Catholic church is clear on the fact that they would rather have live humans die than let a dead fetus be used for the betterment of mankind.
August 1st, 2008 at 2:18 PM
Leroy,
I have absolutely and unequivocally proven that the EFCA DOES eliminate the right to a private ballot. You’ve even yielded that point yourself, a number of times.
I’ll ask you again: What happens when 50 percent of employees, minus 1 ask for a PRIVATE ballot when 50 percent plus one have been cajoled into PUBLICLY signing their union card?
The answer is that there will be NO secret ballot, because EFCA eliminated that right.
Jeeebus H. Keeeeerist, I can’t believe you still harbor the erroneous notion that EFCA protects employees rights. What do you and the DFL have against voting rights?
August 1st, 2008 at 2:21 PM
Back to the pro-life issue at hand….
“And there has never been one iota of debate over killing humans for research. You and I both know that fetuses are the question.”
Yes, and what kind of fetuses are those? Zebras? Or humans?
The Catholic church believes that life begins at conception, so what you call a fetus, it correctly calls a human.
You advocate killing that human for medical research. The church advocates protecting that human. The Catholic church is steadfast in its believe that killing humans and desecrating human remains for medical research is immoral.
It’s not that difficult, Leroy.
It’s impossible to better mankind by debasing mankind.
August 1st, 2008 at 2:24 PM
To be clear, all embryonic stem cell research requires the death of a human. Leroy and the Democrats believe it is moral to raise humans and kill them to harvest their remains for medical research.
I don’t care what ends you think you’ll reach taking that path, there is nothing moral or ethical about it.
August 1st, 2008 at 2:28 PM
On the other hand, given their view of the dignity of human life at its earliest moments, it’s no wonder why Democrats are so callous about issues of genocide and mass murder.
August 1st, 2008 at 4:18 PM
No one has answered the question.
Eric Paulsen and Michele Bachmann each belong to a church that believes that the Pope is the Antichrist.
Are the ambiguously gay duo of Pat and Matt going to hold court today and declare their views to be anti-Catholic as well?
August 1st, 2008 at 8:31 PM
why Democrats are so callous about issues of genocide and mass murder.
c’mon Chestnut, where have Democrats been callous about genocide? especially compared to the current administration. Clinton at least tried in Somalia, and was pretty damn successful in Bosnia to end the humanitarian crisis there.
Bush hasn’t done squat about Darfur and has made the humanitarian situation in Iraq much worse than it was before. (I do admit that Iraq has finally been brought under control and I’ll even give credit to a lot of it because surge and for the Sunni resurgence (whatever that is)) And that is saying a lot compared to what Hussein did.
August 2nd, 2008 at 12:16 AM
Saint Michael, the Archangel, defend us in battle; be our protection against the wickedness and snares of the devil. May God rebuke him, we humbly pray, and do thou, O prince of the heavenly host, by the power of God, thrust into Hell, Satan and all the other evil spirits, who prowl throughout the world, seeking the ruin and destruction of souls. Amen.
August 2nd, 2008 at 4:31 PM
Could you guys pipe down a little about Franken? Some of us WANT him to be the nominee. Let’s not blow it at this late date.
August 5th, 2008 at 1:10 AM
Hey, Y’all talk about being gay like it’s a bad thing.